World of Pageantry

World of Pageantry

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 54 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next

Should sophmores and freshman be given the same chance to become section leaders?
only if the freshman is responsible and mature 46%  46%  [ 47 ]
seniority should come first 53%  53%  [ 54 ]
Total votes : 101
Author Message
 Post subject: freshman section leaders
PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2004 10:26 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2004 5:28 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Oceanside
if there is two sophmores and one freshman in a tie for section leader,do you think seniority should win or that everyone should have the same equal chance regardless of their grade?

_________________
G-Unit~!

Oceanside High School Drumline....
The Driving Force Behind Any Successful Pirate Raid...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2004 11:20 pm 
Offline
Veteran
Veteran
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 26, 2004 12:42 pm
Posts: 711
Location: UCSD, La Jolla, CA
I definitely think it should be about the maturity over the age. I myself have been a leader to people older than me in the past, so maybe I'm biased, but I think as long as the person is dedicated and mature and willing to lead, there should be no problem. In fact, right now almost half of our section leaders in our band are sophmores and it is working out just wonderfully, but only because they're all mature. I guess it just depends on the person really. I've seen plently of highly immature seniors.

_________________
"Suck Less"


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2004 12:58 am 
Offline
Drum Major
Drum Major
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 5:21 pm
Posts: 2412
Location: Jerusalem, Israel
Firstly, I accidentally clicked seniority should come first. I really meant equal chance. Secondly, I don't think this is even a seniority issue. Basically, it breaks down to two things (in my mind):

1) Can this person effectively lead their peers (part of this is unfortunately seniority). Can they organize and run sectionals and rehearsals.

2) Does this person understand their instrument and music theory well enough to teach it. Basically, will this person be able to be a resource (as a section leader should be) in learning music and practicing difficult literature.

If a freshmen/sophmore meets those qualifications I see no reason they can't be a good section leader. Unfortunately, with the exception of the incredibly charismatic, I'd say very few freshmen could meet requirement one.

_________________
It's 5:00... do you know where your ancestors came from?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2004 9:36 am 
Offline
Drum Major
Drum Major
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2003 12:38 am
Posts: 2858
Location: Los Angeles
whats the point of maturity when the person has no experience....
theres many aspects to the 'who can do a better job' question

_________________
WHS '05, UCSB '10
WOP OT Round 1 Picture Battle Champion!
WOP OT Mafia Game II: First ever mafia champions
http://officeofstrategicinfluence.com/spam/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2004 10:04 am 
Offline
Support Staff
Support Staff
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:58 pm
Posts: 3598
Location: Escondido, Ca
IsnipeWithAknife wrote:
whats the point of maturity when the person has no experience....
theres many aspects to the 'who can do a better job' question


Agreed, a freshman leader is probably a bad idea, they wouldn't know what to do. They have to be taught first. If it was a tie between a Soph and a Fresh than the Soph should get it hands down. When I was in high school freshman couldn't try-out to be section leaders the youngest section leaders were at least sophmores so they had some experience.

_________________
Go read "Ishmael" a novel by Daniel Quinn. It will literally change your life.
Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges.
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: depends
PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2004 2:45 pm 
Offline
Veteran
Veteran
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2004 7:49 pm
Posts: 352
Location: Montebello/Westwood
it depends who should get it.. if the sophomores are better musicians, but bad leadership and the freshman is a good leader and bad muscian, both of them should be section leader... there can be more than one section leader! but if both of them are the same, then seniority. at the school i go to, for some sections we have to section leaders. even the main section leader is younger than the 2nd one. once again, there can be more than 1 section leader. Having two is better than one. be sure they're the rigth people to do it though

_________________
Eyes with pride!

"Ability may get you to the top but it takes character to keep you there."
-John Wooden

Pi=3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2004 4:48 pm 
Offline
Section Leader
Section Leader
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2002 6:50 pm
Posts: 976
Location: UC Irvine
Although a freshman may be better at their instrument or even more mature, they don't have experience with the program yet. They need at least a year of experience to see how things are run in the particular program before they are going to be able to lead their peers. Also, no matter how good of a leader the freshman might be, upperclassmen are probably not going to listen to them unfortunately. Let the more esperienced person be leader first, and the freshman can be a leader next year once they have some experience how things are run.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: soph vs fresh
PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2004 4:29 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2004 5:28 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Oceanside
at our school, leadership and a good attitude override skill. i mean, if someone had the greatest amount of skill possible but had a bad attitude and hardly any leadership skills, do you really see that as someone you could get along with or helping you and the drumline as a whole in anyway?

_________________
G-Unit~!

Oceanside High School Drumline....
The Driving Force Behind Any Successful Pirate Raid...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2004 12:27 pm 
Offline
Grand PooBah
Grand PooBah
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2003 5:27 pm
Posts: 3510
Location: Yuma, Arizona
Here's how I think of it:

You have a job opening at a huge corporation that makes millions of dollars a year and it just so happens that this job opening is a rather important job...maybe a vice president or something. Now ask yourself...would you rather hire someone who has been in that world of business before who has the experience or someone who just got out of college with thier degree in business? I'd pick the more exerpienced person. Sure, the college person could know all the information in the world and can be the most mature person on the planet, but they lack overall experience in the world of business. Just look at it...why are most CEO's and other high ranking company officials fairly old?

Same sort of thing with marching band. A section leader/student leader is a critical part of any marching/performing organization. Again, the fresman could be the most mature person ever known to man and may know how to work well with other people but they lack experience in dealing with such things. They are fresh to the world of marching and new in the world of leadership. They may have the skills...they've just never used them before.

That is why I would say seniority. Now if you have no reasonable older members, then maybe look at the younger classmen...but thats in extreme circumstances.

_________________
"It is your destiny to be the leader who uses this event to rally a city, a nation...a world"

"Its not what you do or what you say, but HOW you do it that matters the most"

UC: Riverside, Class Of 2007


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:00 pm 
Offline
New Recruit
New Recruit
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2003 5:46 pm
Posts: 38
Location: Southern California
I am completely against senority (unless it's for fruitless things like being the first in choosing the job you want for a hosted concert or something).

But with that note, I don't think freshmen should ever be placed in a leadership position as high as a section leader. Assistants are great -- a great learning experience for a future *young* section leader.

Part of the job I think is knowing your own backyard... if you can't answer questions about your own program, or understand how the program works, how can you help others in understanding it?

Speaking from experience, freshmen trained in leadership without being given a high ranking title (basically, being an assistant would be fine) grow to be great leaders -- our program trained freshmen with lower ranked titles and they've now become wonderful leaders.

It's maturity and leadership qualities over age when it comes to deciding the outcome of a less-than-leaderlike older person versus a highly acute and wonderfully leaderistic (lol, my own new word) younger person.

I would think the sophomores in your case aren't the shining apples of the group since you're posing this question huh?

~Jessi

_________________
"Do not dwell in the past, do not dream of the future, concentrate the mind on the present moment."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2005 4:19 am 
Offline
Drum Major
Drum Major
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 1:18 am
Posts: 1956
Location: Riverside



Hey! Madame_Spooky

I agree with you in some parts about section leaders vs age. But in my experience I also had to agree with Goth_MV_Tenor. I dont think that a freshmen would have the experience that would be require to be in that postions. But then back to my experience. I had the honor to be a great leadership whole while I was in High School from being a Co-Section Leader to a Assistant Drum Major and Drum Major. But then it would all be about how that person would do as a section leader of in any kind of position at all.


8-) :D

_________________
Moreno Valley HS
*Front Ensemble/Battery Instructor* 08-09
*Drill Designer* 08
Temescal Canyon HS
*Front Ensemble Instructor* 05-08
*Marching Instructor* 05-07
Tracy Community Drumline
*Co-Director*
*Music Arranger*
*Drill Designer*


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2005 9:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2004 7:52 pm
Posts: 3
I believe that senority does and should not matter. At my school, freshman dont try out for leadership positions particularly cause they have never been in the program and dont know how it works. At the end of my freshman year, however, i tried out for section leader, trying out against another freshman, at the time, and a sophmore, and i am not pit captain. In my section, I have two juniors, two sophmores, and six freshman, and im learning a new instrument. I am also the only sophmore section leader at my school. It shouldnt matter, though thats not saying it does.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2005 6:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:04 pm
Posts: 8
Location: San Diego, CA

_________________
Mt. Carmel High School Marching Sundevils
- - - - - - - - - - - -
[2003-2004] Freshman Class Rep
[2004- present] Bass Clarinet Section Leader
[2004- present] Principal Bass Clarinetist

the sun NEVER sets.


Last edited by csmoot on Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: younger leaders
PostPosted: Tue Jan 04, 2005 8:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 7:14 pm
Posts: 9
Location: Southern California
Okay...at my school...the director picks the leaders before he even gets the roster of all new freshmen to the program, so that eliminates the freshmen being leaders. Secondly, I voted for equal chance because at our school, we have to go through an interview process in order to be considered for a leadership position. (Even if you were already a leader, you had to go through this.) This interview poses situations which could happen over the course of the next year, and assesses the abilities of each applicant. (Basically like a job interview.) Questions that were asked were, "If there was a person in your section that continually misbehaved, how would you handle the situation?" or "What can you do for your section for next year?" One of the questions mentioned in my interview was "How would handle a sophomore as a drum major or your section leader?" My answer was that if they were the most qualified for the position, then by all means they deserve it, and I would respect them for that.

All I'm trying to say is that seniority doesn't determine who gets to be section leader. What's determines it is how qualified and committed the person is. I agree with the age being what determines the leadership position. Not the age you are, but the age you act. And as long as the leader knows what they're doing, I support equal chance.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 8:12 pm 
Offline
Veteran
Veteran
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 339
Location: The Band Room, Poway
1] Freshmen don't have cars, so it's pretty hard for them to get to an event exactly when needed(Well, unless they're like me and were held back and turned 16 during the year)

2] They're brand new to the program, and people look up to the section leader for advice and help with marching and all of that, and a freshman wouldn't be able to answer the questions the same way as a junior or senior would.

3] Also sophomores probably wouldn't have as much experience and as good of playing ability as the juniors and seniors.

Basically, those were some of the many reasons why juniors and seniors should be section leaders. It wouldn't be that great if you were a senior and had a freshman section leader who didn't know anything about the program, yet you still had to listen to them, even if they were wrong.

_________________
Emerald Brigade
2004: Circutry
2005: Locomotion
2006: Queen: We Will Rock You

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 54 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
  http://www.worldofpageantry.com Copyright © 1996 - 2006 Email:  admin@worldofpageantry.com  

Site design and maintenance by Dave Schaafsma at Dave's Web Dynamics