Screamer Note

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DJ Dilicious
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Screamer Note

Post by DJ Dilicious » Tue Nov 11, 2003 2:33 pm

I play tenor sax in my marching band. While our trumpets are good, their range isn't amazing. The alto sax section leader and I are able to hit altissimo notes in tune for the most part. Has anyone ever heard a sax intentionally hit a really really high note in a marching band? Does it have the same punch as a trumpet screamer note?

Btw, this is for the last 12-count note of our closer, Batman Finale. The note is a concert C above the staff, which is the D two octaves above the staff for tenor sax.
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Post by MonsoonTrumpetSectLeadr05 » Tue Nov 11, 2003 3:45 pm

due to the way the saxophone is built, it can be loud, but cannot project as much because it sends the sound in 1 direction only, whereas the trumpet flares out the sound making it loud and allowing it to project. thats what jazz saxophonist Ernie Delfontaine (heh sp?) told our sax section during jazz band last year....so naturally you cannot hear a high pitched saxophone "scream" (saxes cant scream heh) on the field as easily as you would hear my Double G, A, or Bb on the field. Trumpets can pierce throught the pyramid of sound easily.

and as a side note, it is uncommon for high school trumpets to scream (and if they can its is hard for them to project) so dont criticize your trumpets range...you should be happy if they have a Bb or a C above the staff cuz thats the average for all highschoolers. Most of my section has high Ds above the staff, others go a bit higher, and i lead them with a consistent double G/A and the double Bb on my good days...it takes time and dedication...and me being a junior, i still have to perfect my range for next year whereas i will unleash the fury :twisted: :twisted:

its much easier for a sax to play high, juss bite the friggin reed...unlike us tpts...we cant bite anything
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altissimo range

Post by altohack » Tue Nov 11, 2003 3:53 pm

MonsoonTrumpetSectLeadr05 wrote: its much easier for a sax to play high, juss bite the friggin reed...unlike us tpts...we cant bite anything
Nope.
It's just has hard as a trumpet. Let's clarify this:
For trumpet, you need a lot of air and a different aumbochure (sp) to play a high notes you pointed out right?
For saxes, its the same thing.
You're right in that it doesn't have the same effect, but an altissimo note is pretty impressive.
One of my friends can hit a high G and A on alto (concert Bb and C), with ease (I think its in tune).
For me, I can hit a G (concert Bb) if I can manage to remember the fingering :D
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Post by DJ Dilicious » Tue Nov 11, 2003 7:40 pm

Actually, the reason a sax can't be heard very well is because it doesn't project sound in one direction. Due to the open keys on a sax, it actually sends sound out from nearly all directions, but most comes from the front. Bell-front instruments, on the other hand, project sound from the bell so they are highly directional.

Yeah, it's hard for saxes and trumpets to hit really high notes, just in different ways. When hitting altissimo notes on a sax, it's almost like partials on a brass instrument. The fingering I use for a double D (hehe) is the same as F above the staff, but the embouchre is different. It's not just biting down on the reed, that may make you squawk, but to squawk in tune (as we so lovingly call the altissimo register) you have to tighten your embouchre more than bite down on the reed. It's taken me months to be able to actually hit this note right off the bat rather than hit the F and then move up to the D.

I'm not trying to criticize our trumpets. They're very talented musicians, especially considering that all but one are freshmen. I just think a really high note at the end of the show would be cool and I was wondering whether or not it is effective to do it on sax. Given a little while, I'm sure they'll be able to hit insanely high notes, but until then, this is the only alternative.
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altissimo

Post by altohack » Tue Nov 11, 2003 8:32 pm

Well, there are altissimo note fingerings too
http://www.geocities.com/jazzsaxamaphon ... simo1.html
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Post by DJ Dilicious » Tue Nov 11, 2003 8:48 pm

This is a great site for alternate fingerings for any woodwind (it has altissimo sax fingerings):

http://www.wfg.woodwind.org/fing.html
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indeedy

Post by saxman139 » Tue Nov 11, 2003 8:54 pm

i agree with senor dilicious: the saxophone does project sound in all directions, hence the holes. were you got the idea that mr del fonte (that is the right spelling, ive met him several times :wink:) said that, i dont know. and yes, the trumpet does project in a more directional manner. its all physics.

oh, and btw, its not easier for the saxes to hit altissimo. it require hours of practice to perfect altissimo, even the upper register, because it is harder to tune. you cant just bite down and hit the right note, it takes a long time to perfect the fingering and aumbuchere. i promise! i know lots of people think the register key is the cheaters way of hitting high notes, but it doesnt make it as easy as you might think.

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Post by IsnipeWithAknife » Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:01 pm

for not playing the sax or any woodwinds i cant say which is harder. but believe be us brass players have 'good and bad' days where we just cant hit certain notes. all you guys have to do is press buttons while we work out our chops (playing notes in general) if we keep trying to hit high notes our lips will be dead to play anything while u guys can keep using your keys with ur fingers.

all i'm gonna say is give your trumpets a break especially if one of em got braces recently
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Re: indeedy

Post by MonsoonTrumpetSectLeadr05 » Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:48 pm

saxman139 wrote:i agree with senor dilicious: the saxophone does project sound in all directions, hence the holes. were you got the idea that mr del fonte (that is the right spelling, ive met him several times :wink:) said that, i dont know. and yes, the trumpet does project in a more directional manner. its all physics.
well given the fact that he was clinicing the saxes while us trumpets were sitting there bored and not really paying attention to sumthin that doesnt matter to us, i think i got what he said backwards....but you kno wut i mean
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Post by Bandmaster » Wed Nov 12, 2003 4:28 am

Yes, tenor sax can play high notes. Have you ever listened to the Saturday Night Live Band and Lenny Picket play the theme song at the beginning of the show? He hits notes never dreamed of on a tenor sax. I first saw him play when he was 19 and a member of Tower of Power's horn line. WOW!

True, a sax can't project as powerfully as a trumpet, but that doesn't mean it can't project really well. I have heard sax soloists part your hair in the back row of an auditorium by just knowing how to breath right. Breath support means everything.

Now for you trumpet players out there, I have a treat for you. An MP3 of Disney's Future Corps featuring a hot screaming duet. Enjoy!

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disney future corps

Post by altohack » Wed Nov 12, 2003 3:18 pm

Bandmaster wrote: An MP3 of Disney's Future Corps featuring a hot screaming duet. Enjoy!

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Disney's future corps??
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Future Corps?

Post by Bandmaster » Thu Nov 13, 2003 12:56 am

They used to be a roaming performing group at Disney World in Florida. They also had one for awhile at Disneyland years ago. They were a one one-on-a-part mini drum and bugle corps made up of professional performers. They seem to come and go depending on the mood in Disney's front office. This recording was made 5 years ago in Florida.
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Disney

Post by thom » Thu Nov 13, 2003 9:23 am

Dave,
You got the info right, but in CA Disney, they were known as the Kingdom Korps.

Great recording by the way.

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screamin'

Post by tubabrassman » Tue Nov 18, 2003 10:14 pm

I have played trumpet since I was in 5th grade and now I currently play tuba. I still play trumpet and i am only a sophmore and i can hit a triple C in tune and loud to piss off the band director. Alot of it (I think) is your lung and diaphram strength to get that amount of air and the force needed to play that high, in tune, and sound good. it also helps if you spend hours of research on proper techniques on how to acheive those notes. pratice helps too. I have noticed you can do it on almost any mouthpiece, I use a Markciewicz (spelling????) E14.1 mouthpiece and it is of comparison to a Schlike 13a4a. Those mouthpieces are easy to hit those high notes but i have acheived a double G on a 7C mouthpiece, it wasn't that hard but it was easier than I thought. but since we don't have decent tubas in our band i am stuck to that. but keep praticin' your upper register.

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Post by CptInsano » Wed Nov 19, 2003 10:35 am

Yea, both our tennors in my band hit high notes in our show. I can hit pretty high, but the intesity of the show, We get pretty exzausted at the end of the show, So i beleive the tennors hit the high note we got for us lol. But maybe a little too high!
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