World of Pageantry

World of Pageantry

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:07 am 
Offline
New Recruit
New Recruit

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:14 am
Posts: 11
Comparing and contrasting parade routines, and L pattern competitons in northern, and southern California. :D I'm obviously biased to the south because i'm from the south. :D
Your opinions.

_________________
Joshua Raymond Leduc
John Glenn High School Marching Eagle Band
Drum Major/Drumline Captain
2006-2010


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 8:56 am 
Offline
Support Staff
Support Staff
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 6:46 am
Posts: 7944
Location: West Allis, WI
Broad statement (so of course there are exceptions), but I'll go with: SoCal Military DMs are usually superior to NorCal, and NorCal Mace DMs are usually superior to SoCal.

The Scottish/Regimental style is VERY popular in NorCal, so a LOT of bands use mace. Benicia, Bethel, Buhach, Concord, Dublin, Franklin, Golden Valley all have great Mace drum majors. In the past, Fairfield, Vallejo, Santa Cruz, Lincoln, Merced, and Ukiah always had great Mace drum majors. At the very least they're the equals of bands like Glendora and Mt. Carmel.

Most of the military drum majors I've seen in SoCal (Arcadia, El Dorado, etc.) blow away most of the military drum majors I've seen in NorCal. Although Encinal HS in Alameda almost always has a good drum major, and had some GREAT drum majors back in the 90s, early-2000s. NorCal schools that have military DMs tend to run very hot and cold, though.

Just my opinion, and I'm not an expert on the subject. YMMV.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:56 pm 
Offline
New Recruit
New Recruit

Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2009 8:18 pm
Posts: 22
I would have to say Nor-Cal Mace Drum Majors are more skilled compared to So-Cal counterparts.

From what I've seen from Military DM's in So-Cal, they seem to have many elements that are the same in their flourishes. I personally believe what makes you better is your execution and variety in routines. I have to give it to Military DM's like Arcadia, Rancho Bernardo, and Riverside King. They are excellent Military Drum Majors.

I would have to say in the North there is more routine construction and more variety. From the North, there are many excellent Military DM's. Granite Bay HS, Encinal, Las Plumos Oriville, and Atwater HS all have excellent Military DM's, earning 90 or higher in L-Pattern AND Parade season. I would have to say Granada HS in the north has some of the best Military Drum Majors I have ever seen. ( Of course I am a Military DM from Granada, but on paper, our DM's have always been earning 93's and higher in L-Pattern Champs).

It would be interesting to see North DM's go down south to compete and vice-versa, that, in my opinion is the best way to determine who's got it.

_________________
Umayr Sufi
Granada H.S Asst. Drum Major 2008-2010
Drum Major Instructor
http://www.umayrsufi.com


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:28 am 
Offline
New Recruit
New Recruit

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:14 am
Posts: 11
lol i resent that comment, norcal is superior in mace. in scsboa parade, we are far more limited to what we can do. We have thirty seconds to get the band moving. routines ncba drum majors do would not do so hot in the south. much more strict. But for L patterns, looking at videos from this last year, i think the south had stronger mace spinners. :P

_________________
Joshua Raymond Leduc
John Glenn High School Marching Eagle Band
Drum Major/Drumline Captain
2006-2010


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:06 am 
Offline
New Recruit
New Recruit
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2009 1:46 pm
Posts: 61
Location: Atwater, Ca
jghsdrummer14 wrote:
lol i resent that comment, norcal is superior in mace. in scsboa parade, we are far more limited to what we can do. We have thirty seconds to get the band moving. routines ncba drum majors do would not do so hot in the south. much more strict. But for L patterns, looking at videos from this last year, i think the south had stronger mace spinners. :P

NCBA drum majors have 30 seconds to start the band as well

_________________
Buhach Colony 2010-2011 Drum Major
Giving up is never an option. Learn from your mistakes and get better.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:41 pm 
Offline
Support Staff
Support Staff
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:51 am
Posts: 562
Location: Tustin
Let's keep this civil. 8-)

Disclaimer: These are my personal opinions as an instructor, please do not take this any other way. :D

The big difference between NorCal and SoCal DM's from what I've noticed is the different environments that they're in. NorCal and SoCal judges look for different things, and it affects the organizations' participating DM's looks as a whole.

NorCal DM's can argue that they have more for routine construction, but at the expense of body and head movements. It almost seems like NorCal DM's are expected to show off more for the judges. SoCal DM's on the other hand are pretty much expected to have flawless execution, not just for their score, but to also contribute to the Showmanship score of the band. SoCal routines are also expected to flow, with minimal stops, at least from the general consensus that I've seen from different judges' sheets.

NorCal DM's for parades, as far as I've seen from videos on YouTube are fairly good. Same goes for the SoCal ones. Military DM's, as a majority, yes I feel like more DM's of a higher skill level is here in SoCal. Does that mean we have the best ones? Who knows? Majority of mace DM's with higher skill level? MAYBE SoCal. The bias here is that I'm a tough instructor that demands high execution from my students, and the YouTube videos I've seen from NorCal DM's show off a lot of head, eye, and body movement. Again... This is all my opinion as an instructor.

I have seen some really good Mace and Military DM's come from the north also. Danielle Battisti and Andrew Cheung are two of my favorites. NorCal has a very interesting "show" style. Lots of stops, and lots of tricks, and it's very different from what we have down here. I'm just waiting for more of their parade DM's to add just a little more of the militaristic and strict look that Danielle Battisti had from those videos which makes her look really sharp. I guess that's just my preference, and why I liked watching her.

Don't forget a few things though... A great spinner doesn't usually equal a great leader. Drum majoring is mainly about leadership. Also, as competitive as you might get, don't forget to have a great sportsmanship attitude, and never forget to have fun! :tup:

__________
Bryan Stewart B. Millares
DM Instructor
Some of my students...
Mace examples:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vicXKBDVZt4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pFiyYN9kjI
Military examples:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lp6ifOtlPRA&feature=PlayList&p=E4A9E6ED34E6607B&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8EjrwWyk3J8


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:19 pm 
Offline
Section Leader
Section Leader

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:41 pm
Posts: 920
Location: Chicago, IL
You are too kind, Bryan, haha. I do agree with many things you've stated in your post. A lot of the DMs I see up here focus too much on content and not enough on polishing and cleaning to achieve that crisp, snappy style that is prevalent in strong DMs down south. That's not to say that there aren't crisp and snappy DMs up here in the north, but they're not nearly as numerous as they are in your neck of the woods. Execution is a big part of what I stress with anyone I instruct, and it's one of the big stylistic problems I want to correct up here. Granted, I can't do it on my own, but I'm trying hard to start a trend of "execution over content."

With that said, I've seen way too many "safe" routines down south that revolve around the same spins over and over again. While execution is something to definitely focus on, it wouldn't kill some of these kids to throw in something outside of the old "roundhouse/reverse roundhouse/toss/prop spin" cycle, y'know? :king:

_________________
"To think idly is to think for the sake of doing nothing, or to think too much on what one has done and not on what there is to do." - San Manuel Bueno, mártir


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:09 am 
Offline
Support Staff
Support Staff
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:51 am
Posts: 562
Location: Tustin
ZJH wrote:
With that said, I've seen way too many "safe" routines down south that revolve around the same spins over and over again. While execution is something to definitely focus on, it wouldn't kill some of these kids to throw in something outside of the old "roundhouse/reverse roundhouse/toss/prop spin" cycle, y'know? :king:



Ha ha ha! I can't speak for all SoCal DM's, but I know what you mean. It's either because it's safer, or they're still in the learning process. I know I had two beginners step-off this year on the street, they had something close to the sequence you mentioned, and we had to be creative with their routines while marching since they haven't really practiced both yet (think walking and chewing gum at the same time) :rotf: but you gotta do whatever you can as an instructor to make sure they stay in-step.

Another thing about SoCal DM's compared to NorCal DM's, I noticed that NorCal DM's nod at the judges during the salute, and some even turn their bodies towards them. I know that SoCal DM's stick to a more traditional and military style, and they'll for sure to get comments regarding those movements if they were to do them in their salutes. So Andrew, do you know where/ when that came from for NorCal?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 10:17 pm 
Offline
Section Leader
Section Leader

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:41 pm
Posts: 920
Location: Chicago, IL
I'm definitely not the one to ask about origins of any sort, haha. If you wanna find out about the origins of any particular DM practice in NorCal, Rick Wilson's your best bet at finding the answer. But regarding the nod or the sort of unorthodox salute breaks one can see up here, they're definitely just personal choices. I was guilty of doing too back when I competed in high school, but it was purely just a stylistic element. My best guess at its origin was probably someone started doing at L-Patterns one year and it caught on. Remember: just my guess, not fact. lol

_________________
"To think idly is to think for the sake of doing nothing, or to think too much on what one has done and not on what there is to do." - San Manuel Bueno, mártir


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:37 pm 
Offline
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:08 pm
Posts: 237
you have 2 different regions that have 2 different styles in the art of drum majoring. importance is relative, after all.


id say that socal drum majors are more polished than norcal drum majors in SPINNING. however, if youre looking for content over clenliness, then i think you would see the demise of socal spinners. granite bay has a DM that competed down south here last year. and he was good, definitely good, but his competition seemed to edge him out at most of the competitions. however, i highly doubt a socal DM could go up north and fair any better.

conducting has the same issues. different styles, however i honestly believe that norcal has the advantage here. personally, im not in to their style overall of conducting. i think its way too regimented -- i like it to be very expressive and creative, and i think thats what a band needs more than regiment during a performance. but i have seen norcal drum majors come in to the socal DM circuits and be unbelievably successful, so obviously their style is compatible with ours. the socal style would not be very competitive up north. thats not a bad thing, however. i think drum majors should be able to adjust to their environment and be able to put forth a performance capable of winning - IOW, i think socal DM's should be able to create routines that match a norcal style in the event that socal DM's go up there to compete. ya gotta play the game sometimes.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:36 pm 
Offline
Section Leader
Section Leader

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:41 pm
Posts: 920
Location: Chicago, IL
cup_o_noodles007 wrote:
id say that socal drum majors are more polished than norcal drum majors in SPINNING. however, if youre looking for content over clenliness, then i think you would see the demise of socal spinners. granite bay has a DM that competed down south here last year. and he was good, definitely good, but his competition seemed to edge him out at most of the competitions. however, i highly doubt a socal DM could go up north and fair any better.


Alan Riley came up north to the Vintage Reserve Band Review in Napa, CA in 2006 with Arcadia and absolutely decimated the competition. Then again, the quality of military drum majors up north has been very hit and miss.

_________________
"To think idly is to think for the sake of doing nothing, or to think too much on what one has done and not on what there is to do." - San Manuel Bueno, mártir


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:44 pm 
Offline
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:08 pm
Posts: 237
haha, well that and when it comes to spinning, Alan Riley is a god among men. thats usually pretty helpful no matter where you go. but for most drum majors down here, they would have a lot of difficulty going north. especially the conductors.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 3:08 pm 
Offline
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Sun May 25, 2003 9:35 pm
Posts: 211
I've always had so much respect for the competition between the NorCal and the SoCal drum majors, I remember when Ben Jiang from Arcadia came up to NorCal to compete in the USA North competitions when they were held. One of cleanest spinners I've known, with execution that would destroy competition left and right and it was always a pleasure to compete against him.

It's funny how there are mace and military moves that have yet to be seen in NorCal that are done in SoCal and vice versa, which would complete the connection between our two lines, but at the same time, it's also our move set that make us unique. Though I would agree to some extent that the NorCal drum majors have much more to show in the caption of "Routine Analysis" or "Routine Construction", I can vouch for SoCal because they have moves down there that no one in the north have yet to attempt or competitively use, let alone have the execution that most SoCal drum majors have to use it, though there have been a good amount of drum majors in the north that have had great execution and I've had the pleasure of watching and competing with them myself.

Those were the days, hahaha...

I can definitely say that one of those drum majors up in the north was Maureen Britton from Vallejo, who not only could spin cleanly but also had the routine content to match! Same with many drum majors from Fairfield, Benicia, Jesse Bethel, and what not. I'm excited for what this year's competition has to bring! I'm going to enjoy watching this...

Don't you, Andrew? :bow:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:45 pm 
Offline
Section Leader
Section Leader

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:41 pm
Posts: 920
Location: Chicago, IL
I'll be judging Rodriguez on Saturday, haha. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing what the kids have to offer this year. You gonna be there?

_________________
"To think idly is to think for the sake of doing nothing, or to think too much on what one has done and not on what there is to do." - San Manuel Bueno, mártir


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NCBA vs. SCSBOA Drum Majors
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:04 pm 
Offline
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Sun May 25, 2003 9:35 pm
Posts: 211
I'm going to try to make it, my kids are floor painting that day, but I'm sending a couple of my students to compete haha... they'll have fun, like they usually do and I believe they're ready for it.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
  http://www.worldofpageantry.com Copyright © 1996 - 2006 Email:  admin@worldofpageantry.com  

Site design and maintenance by Dave Schaafsma at Dave's Web Dynamics