World of Pageantry

Ryan H. Turner wrote:Because bigger is alllllllllllllllllllllllways better....

Yep.

grouchy wrote:I wasn't speaking about your group in particular, Justin, but small programs comparative to larger programs - as I've never seen your band, just John's winter line. Tom brought up the desirability of having 6a resources over 2a resources and you stated that your preference would be to grow your ensemble within your philosophy. I agree that this is the appropriate take and made the comparison that Open class corps feel the same way about their programs - making a merge unfeasible.

No flames, just words.

1) You have yet to identify yourself

2) I am highly irritated by your statement of "more successful group down the road". That comment was a lame, cheap shot.

3) Since you're admitting that you've never seen all our ensembles (which encompass our "program") ....I think it's best to keep your criticizing comments to yourself. You cannot evaluate something you have not seen.

1) My identity is irrelevant to the topic of corps merging.

2) Your level of irritation is beyond my control.

3) I wasn't evaluating your program. It was about large vs small. "a better experience" vs a less-than-better experience. multi-philosophy vs mono-philosophy.

At this point I'll just assume any further response will be off topic as well. Meh.

I believe the point was that these open corps struggle to get members and if they pay staff it's crumbs at best. If they were to merge they could pool resources and be able to get a full staff, a higher quality staff, and pay that full/high quality staff what they are worth as opposed to recruiting them into slave labor for the summer and then pressuring them to get their students to join.

So more kids, better/more staff, perhaps more resources to afford not wondering if there is or is not going to be a national tour and something other than pb&j and hi-c for the post 12 hour rehearsal meal. This sounds like a better experience to me.

After watching some open corps shows this week, I was reminded of the So. Cal drum corps scene in the late 60's/early 70's. There were quite a few of what would now be considered 'open class" corps floating around the area. With at least five active open corps in the LA/OC area, and a few more on and off in San Diego, and a growing Arizona market, we are experiencing a very similar surge in the activity. Overall, this is a good thing.
The concern, of course, is that not all drum corps are created equal. As someone mentioned earlier, there are many different philosophies on instruction and corps management. This is easily witnessed in the parking lot, as well as on the field. I saw groups with strong percussion but weak brass, groups with poor musical selections but decent visual skills and design, groups that are very underprepared, and groups that seemed right on schedule for mid July. Talking with support staff, some were poised and ready to continue on a longer venture, while others where just hoping to make it through the next week without disaster.
What will hopefully come about through all this is twofold: for one, there are currently a lot of summer rehearsal and performance opportunities for our kids to be involved in. Regardless of the level of competition, this is generally a good thing. Second, at some point, it is likely that a few of these groups will emerge from the field of mediocrity (not a slam there, just a description) and become strong world class organizations, as has happened in the past.
Something that should be different is that the medium has evolved to include a more enlightened group of instructors and management personnel who recognize the importance of supporting the youth music scene in general; including supporting, not supplanting, local high school music programs. School music instructors in turn may now be more likely to see the benefit of these additionally opportunities for musical (not to mention personal) growth for their students.
At any rate, it's exciting to see the amount of groups and opportunities that are currently out there - let's help it grow!

Teever wrote:After watching some open corps shows this week, I was reminded of the So. Cal drum corps scene in the late 60's/early 70's. There were quite a few of what would now be considered 'open class" corps floating around the area. With at least five active open corps in the LA/OC area, and a few more on and off in San Diego, and a growing Arizona market, we are experiencing a very similar surge in the activity. Overall, this is a good thing.
The concern, of course, is that not all drum corps are created equal. As someone mentioned earlier, there are many different philosophies on instruction and corps management. This is easily witnessed in the parking lot, as well as on the field. I saw groups with strong percussion but weak brass, groups with poor musical selections but decent visual skills and design, groups that are very underprepared, and groups that seemed right on schedule for mid July. Talking with support staff, some were poised and ready to continue on a longer venture, while others where just hoping to make it through the next week without disaster.
What will hopefully come about through all this is twofold: for one, there are currently a lot of summer rehearsal and performance opportunities for our kids to be involved in. Regardless of the level of competition, this is generally a good thing. Second, at some point, it is likely that a few of these groups will emerge from the field of mediocrity (not a slam there, just a description) and become strong world class organizations, as has happened in the past.
Something that should be different is that the medium has evolved to include a more enlightened group of instructors and management personnel who recognize the importance of supporting the youth music scene in general; including supporting, not supplanting, local high school music programs. School music instructors in turn may now be more likely to see the benefit of these additionally opportunities for musical (not to mention personal) growth for their students.
At any rate, it's exciting to see the amount of groups and opportunities that are currently out there - let's help it grow!

Great post!!!!!!!!!

Thank you Teever

Merging corps would serve who really?
Back in mid to late 90's, there were not many corps to make a good drum corps show lineup.
If BD and SCV were not there, whats the use?

The way things are now is a good thing.
More adults and kids get exposed to the activity and have an opportunity to participate. That's really the bottom line, or it should be.

I understand the spectator point of view...give me bigger better and more in one corps for my $20.

That only serves a limited demographic. It certainly doesn't serve the community in respect to participation and contribution.

If it is NOT more important for more kids and adults to get involved, participate and fill a show with many groups to watch (though small and local) THEN... those people should stop going to the local Drum Corps Shows and spend their money flying out only to the big venues with many big corps appearing.

The activity has grown in Southern California because there is interest and you don't have to have $200,000 cash flow outside of member fees to start or run a corps anymore.

It has reverted to the community model of drum corps roots and thank God for THAT!

More corps, more kids and adults getting an opportunity to contribute is a beautiful thing.

Because if every kid in a small corps wanted to be in a big corps.....wouldn't they be there...paying the big fees and being on the road for 30-40 days?

I scratch my head here bigOCZ. Everything you say sounds good...but something's not right. Are you saying we should just have more 20-piece ensembles to fill out a tournament? What's the point of that? As far as more people being involved, 6 20-piece corps still equals one big corps, so I'm not sure how more little corps is a positive thing. If it's for more opportunity to perform...ok, but it's not like there are a bunch of corps turning kids away. There are plenty of spots going "un-used" this year in SoCal, wouldn't you agree. By that I mean corps that march nowhere near capacity. And corps that are closer to capacity have a much larger base from which to draw volunteers, money for staff/design, larger crowd support (in sheer numbers via family and friends).

I totally agree with applauding the little guy and supporting their efforts, but this whole post was brought up with the business side in mind right? I watched the shows from Stanford, and I must say it is rough out there. Some groups obviously cannot afford the proper design or instructional staff. The product is far below standard. My reaction is more of "aw man, someone should help those kids"...not "get off the field jerks!" And if anyone has been in the lot during the SCV or BD warm-up, you will see swarms of people who don't really see the need to be in the stadium at 5pm. NO OFFENSE intended. I would vote for a merger of a couple corps...but I am fully aware such a vote will never cross my meager, sloppy desk.

You asked who it will benefit? ANd I think you asked it honestly, THE KIDS WHO MARCH. Pooling instructors, designer, more volunteers, equipment, transportation costs, larger crowd support, more diversity of backgrounds of fellow members, kinda seems simple to me. And again, it is with full respect for the kids I even post about this.

Tom...thanks for being honest. I agree.

(I did type a long-winded email, but decided against posting it because someone would just go off on me...so instead I posted the phrase above.)