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 Post subject: do bands affect the way their drumline will score?
PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 2:58 pm 
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yeah, i see this happen a little bit during first semester.


you see a REALLY good band, with an AWFUL drumline, and their drumline gets like...REALLY high scores.

but on the other hand, you have a REALLY bad band, and your drumline is pretty decent.

like, im from troy. and our band is like....uh, not that good. but our drumline is pretty decent. and during first semester we didnt always score what we should have.

and ive seen other schools (wont mention names) that are like, insanely rad, and their drumline = not very good. but the drumline still manages to take like second or first place every competition.

do y'all think this affect how the drumline will score?
just curious, cos i was talking about it today...wanted to see who else agreed.

thanks!
oh yeah..

good luck to everyone whos playing at championships!
:)
ee!

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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 5:17 pm 
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yes i agree, im also from troy too. haha

i believe that the Band is the most affecting part of the show. its the "heart". i whish i could say its about the drumline, but its about the show, which the band is the biggest part.

we got beat last Fall by some lines that honestly couldnt play, but their bands were freaking awesome. im not saying all good bands have bad lines, but just that there are some out there.

we had a lot of people tell us that our drumline didnt even belong with our band because the line looked like a completely different and well better than the rest of the sections on the field.

as much as the judges try to judge a line, i believe that they get a certain vibe from the show that has nothing to do with the Drumline, and that comes from the band which affects the drumline's scoring.


maybe im wrong, but thats what i think. see ya

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 Post subject: Band/Drumline issue...
PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 6:13 pm 
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I have a different take on this subject. From the almost 20 years I've been an instructor/tech, I think I see things a bit different. Before I begin, I'm not saying I'm an expert or anything even close to that, but just my own observation. I'm not too convinced that the band brings down the drumline scores. What I do feel is that it is a matter of balance as far as how the two mesh musically. Say for example that the band is not strong technique wise and the arrangements are real easy and the line is playing all the hybrid rudiments it can fit into a show. What happens is that the drumline overplays the band. From a drummers standpoint it rocks, but what happens is that the overall continuity of the music is way out of wack! Best way I can describe it is imagine Mike Portnoy's Dream Theatre-style chops played in a Nirvana style song!! It would get totally in the way of the song. The one thing that really turns me off to a show is when the drumline fills every space with chops. Sometimes simplicity is the best weapon. So it may not be a matter of being dragged down by the band, but maybe the book gets in the way of the song. While technique is a major part of the judging,knowing when to let the song breathe is just as important. Again, my own opinion, please don't yell!! :D
I love hearing a line with a great book, but I also love to watch a show and enjoy the overall song.....even the woodwinds!!! JUST KIDDING!!!!!

Steve Elias
Caption Head
El Capitan High School
Lakeside,CA.


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 Post subject: Re: Band/Drumline issue...
PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 6:27 pm 
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Sixfdsteve wrote:
I have a different take on this subject. From the almost 20 years I've been an instructor/tech, I think I see things a bit different. Before I begin, I'm not saying I'm an expert or anything even close to that, but just my own observation. I'm not too convinced that the band brings down the drumline scores. What I do feel is that it is a matter of balance as far as how the two mesh musically. Say for example that the band is not strong technique wise and the arrangements are real easy and the line is playing all the hybrid rudiments it can fit into a show. What happens is that the drumline overplays the band. From a drummers standpoint it rocks, but what happens is that the overall continuity of the music is way out of wack! Best way I can describe it is imagine Mike Portnoy's Dream Theatre-style chops played in a Nirvana style song!! It would get totally in the way of the song. The one thing that really turns me off to a show is when the drumline fills every space with chops. Sometimes simplicity is the best weapon. So it may not be a matter of being dragged down by the band, but maybe the book gets in the way of the song. While technique is a major part of the judging,knowing when to let the song breathe is just as important. Again, my own opinion, please don't yell!! :D
I love hearing a line with a great book, but I also love to watch a show and enjoy the overall song.....even the woodwinds!!! JUST KIDDING!!!!!

Steve Elias
Caption Head
El Capitan High School
Lakeside,CA.



i totally undestand what youre saying.

and i bet thats what happened with us.
cos yeah, our director wrote (...uh....something like that) our show kinda, and yeah. wasnt very good. PLUS the fact that our band is like, flute players thrown on tuba and brass at the last minute. or people from orchestra that need PE credits, so the band guy throws them on something, and teaches them the month before band camp how to play. and our instructor wrote RREEEALLY good parts. and we played them well.

anyway, yeah. i bet thats what happened.

thanks for the input

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werd to the drumline.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 8:47 pm 
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It's pretty frustrating for an instructor when he/she has a good line and wants to showcase that talent and the scores never reflect the time and effort put in. As much as the marching world has become so obsessed with the corps style of playing (nothing wrong with that at all), we sometimes forget the fact that the percussion section is there to accompany and be the pulse of the entire band. The flash, hybrids, and cool chops add so much to the sound, but the human greed factor of adding more to showcase can often backfire. It's a rush when all the pieces fall together and the show smokes. It's crushing when it seems all for not. The one thing you need to keep in mind is that it is all entertainment. Time teaches an instructor to place the right chops at the right points in the music. I love drum corps percussion and always will, but sometimes the paraflamaratamadiddlitaps just get to be too much! :shock: DOH!!!

Best of luck and hope to see your show next season!

Steve Elias
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El Capitan High School
Lakeside CA


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 10:32 pm 
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"paraflamaratamadiddlitaps"


ha.
youre pretty wise on this subject. :)


thanks

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BASS ONE!!! represent

werd to the drumline.
:):)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 16, 2004 10:23 pm 
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Punkme, and all you other cool Troy cats,
As a judge in the fall, I gotta tell you that as many times as not it happens the other way around, and it sometimes freaks that guys on visual, ge and music out. It often DOES happen that a pretty sucky wind and visual program is backed up by a tasty playing, musical drum line, who can actually march. Sixfdsteve pretty much nailed the biggest point though, that it's the total program that drives what's written and performed, otherwise it's kinda like havin' a ghetto car, but a really cool speaker box, you know?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 16, 2004 10:34 pm 
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Teever wrote:
Punkme, and all you other cool Troy cats,
As a judge in the fall, I gotta tell you that as many times as not it happens the other way around, and it sometimes freaks that guys on visual, ge and music out. It often DOES happen that a pretty sucky wind and visual program is backed up by a tasty playing, musical drum line, who can actually march. Sixfdsteve pretty much nailed the biggest point though, that it's the total program that drives what's written and performed, otherwise it's kinda like havin' a ghetto car, but a really cool speaker box, you know?


ah. us two cool troy cats. :)
yeah, i understand that it IS how everythin is fit together as one. poo, i wish it ocul be JUST drumline, JUST overall, and JUST aux. oh well though. s'all good.

oh, that car thing made me "lol".

man...i htink you made like eighty posts tonight sir.

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werd to the drumline.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 1:46 pm 
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Punkme,
That's what indoor drum line season's for!!

Sorry 'bout all the post action, jus catchin' up.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 3:52 pm 
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Teever wrote:
Punkme,
That's what indoor drum line season's for!!

Sorry 'bout all the post action, jus catchin' up.


lol, No Problem... Its always good too hear words of wisdom from adjudicators and drum corps veterans. :wink:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 7:09 pm 
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Teever wrote:
Punkme,
That's what indoor drum line season's for!!

Sorry 'bout all the post action, jus catchin' up.



oh yes.

we DEFINATELY make up for first semester indoor.
:)

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BASS ONE!!! represent

werd to the drumline.
:):)


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 Post subject: underrated
PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 9:43 pm 
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I dont know if a band effects a drumlines score, but they do effect their name. No matter how good your drumline is, nobody will hear about you (in fall anyway) unless you have a good or at least decent band. In the fall of 2002, California High School had arguably the best drumline in all of SoCal. Who knew this? Their band, to put it nicely, was not as good, if you catch my drift. Their band did not make championships and so they did not get the opportunity to shine their either, they did however break 90 at every show, including a 98.something on their second show of the year, insane!!! They did not have the budget financially either to support a winter line so they did not do that, and thus, Cal High's insane drumline graduated and is now a memory known by few.


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 Post subject: underrated & over inflated
PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2004 10:42 pm 
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Well cheeze, I dunno - I don't remember seeing Cal's line this past season, so we gotta take your word on their awesomeness, but a 98 at a second show? C'mon, when was it - December? Sorry, but that just doesn't happen, unless it's some indi show with its own sheets/criteria/judges. I'm sure you guys had a great season though - don't wanna discount that - but it doesn't do you any good to measure yourself when you're using a different sized ruler than everyone else.


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 Post subject: not my line
PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2004 6:24 pm 
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Cal wasnt even my line, i dont go to Cal high school, i just remember going to go see them. The show they got the 98 at might have been an indie show, i dont know for sure, so you have a valid argument. However, they were still the best high school line i have ever seen, and their band was not good at all, so consequently they never got their name out.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 12:58 pm 
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if your line is playing clean youll get the credit. Their are some bands that totally are no good and drumlines are rippen, but if the writters know that a section is weak then they will be careful how they write some of their stuff. Good luck during the fall season!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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